To Make Or Remake: Batman movies
Thursday, January 15th, 2009
Like many in the geek community, I am a big fan of the character of Batman. But off the back of the success of Christopher Nolan’s Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, the possibility of another sequel makes me a little unsettled.
Don’t get me wrong, I loved these two movies, especially The Dark Knight and the compelling performances of all the cast. But going back to the previous offering of Batman feature films, its my belief that the third one is where things started to get shaky and ultimately led to the downfall of what was a very strong beginning to the film franchise.
Perhaps it was the fact that the role of Batman was recast for Batman Forever that made it dampen in appeal for me. While his performance was relatively decent, I just didn’t feel that Val Kilmer got the balance of Batman’s character right. He was too broody in some moments and then comically weird the next. I mean that smile right after when Chase tells Batman she’s met someone else is just ridiculous. Or maybe it was his just a touch too blonde, just an inch too long hair that was slicked down and made him look like a grease ball that did it.
But while Kilmer was bearable as Batman, George Clooney in Batman and Robin was just absurd. A dedicated Hollywood bachelor such as he was a terrible choice for Batman. He may have the rugged handsomeness that Bruce Wayne needs but come on? Who would really believe he had any sort of exemplary fighting ability by which he could capably battle crime while wearing a cape and caul?
It seems that given the admirable performances of Danny Devito, Michelle Pfieffer and Christopher Walken in the second film, the plan for the third was simply to cram the film with as many big name stars as possible. And while each of these actors gave valiant portrayals in their own rights (with the pathetic exception of Nicole Kidman who was so annoying from beginning to end) it was all just too much. Tommy Lee Jones and Jim Carrey really would have sufficed without the need of adding Drew Barrymore, Chris O’Donnell and the woefully misguided Kidman.
Speaking of O’Donnell, the addition of his character Robin to the features franchise was another thing that really sank the last two films for me. The whole storyline was just so lame and cheesy. I was too aware that this was a pretty boy actor playing a role instead of being able to lose myself in the plot and form solid attachments to the character. And given that there have been rumours recently that Robin may resurface in the next Batman instalment, I am more than a little worried. Even if they do decide to cast someone cool like Shia LaBeouf in the role (although I’m not entirely convinced that he could do the role justice, and yes, I know that his possible involvement was quashed as mere conjecture).
But I think the thing about Batman and Batman Returns, and then now about Batman Begins and The Dark Knight is the heightened sense of realism that is present in each of them. Both Michael Keaton and Christian Bale know how to strike the right duality of the character in their interpretations. They have enough brood and purpose driving them on, as well as knowing how to turn up their charm when the situation requires it.
I also think these four films blend the action, drama, and thrillingly disturbing violence in remarkably proficient ways. Especially in Nolan’s films. The villains are so twisted and deranged in their purposes yet so compelling and completely watchable.
So if they are to make or remake yet another Batman movie at some point in the future then I hope that the utmost care is taken. Perhaps it was the lack of involvement of director Tim Burton after Batman Returns that lead to the downfall of the series. This is why I feel that it would be imperative to keep Batman squarely in Nolan’s capable hands. He has such a reverence and insight into the characters and the world of Batman that is really remarkable. I think his desire to remain as true as possible to the source material of the comics while still staying contemporary in his retellings has been a major source of his success with the films.
Another thing that I hope remains of utmost importance for any future Batman movies is the casting of capable and compelling actors. So listen up Hollywood casting types, don’t go knee-jerk for the big name star but go for that interesting left of field option who may not be as prolific but will certainly give the audience one hell of a spectacular performance to watch. Heath Ledger is pretty big name now given his tragic end in this world, but at the time he was cast as the Joker, I honestly couldn’t have thought of another actor that I thought was a more unusual choice for the part. And look how awesome that turned out!
With the joy of many wild rumours throughout the geek community at the moment I still can’t help but flinch at most of the things that are flying around out there. Like any dedicated fan I will be amongst those waiting patiently in line should such a movie be released, but I hope against hope that if they do decide to go ahead with another Batman film project that they take the time to do it right, even if it means waiting an additional year or two for it to come out.
Better that than a rushed job of poorer quality released simply to garner box office sales. I say bring on another Nolan film that courageously attempts to capture the rampant imaginations of fans of this classic cultural icon and to perhaps possibly even create new ones.
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I can see what you mean, 3rd movies are usually the weakest….. but I cant help but want more out of this universe, I believe any more would be a mistake without taking afew years off and setting it much later with a new cast and director.
I think the problem with Batman Forever was definitely the lack of Tim Burton. Like the movies or hate them, they at least had a sense of realism that was not seen in Schumacher’s version of the Batman franchise. It’s something that wasn’t seen again until Christopher Nolan.
I’m opposed to differing versions of Batman. After all, the comics have differed through the eras as well. But Burton and Schumacher were about as different as you could get. You can blame the actors from the 3rd and 4th movies of the original Batman movies for the missteps as well. But you wouldn’t have those actors without a specific step in that direction by Schumacher.
Batman Begins and the Dark Knight are screaming trilogy. So I hope that the gang can get together for one more go. After that, put it to rest, spin it off, or something similar. At the very least, make sure it’s known that any further sequels is loosely attached at best. But this series of Batman movies definitely needs to take its place amongst the best trilogies of all time. The Back to the Future trilogy, the original Star Wars Trilogy, The Godfather trilogy (Though, it wasn’t the typical trilogy), etc.
I agree that these movies are screaming trilogy and I am actually itching for another one to come out just like many, despite my scathingness above, I just have concerns. But I def think that the lack of Burton was a big problem.
I agree that the series does need a final chapter, but that is it. Dragging it out would certainly spell disaster. Honestly, I would love to see Robin in the Jason Todd form with the “Death in the Family” storyline and all. While I know that would mean introducing a Robin that the world at large is unfamiliar with and bringing back the Joker (which seems more and more unlikely), this storyline with play into the beautiful darkness of the last two films. And I think Nolan could handle this story and give it even more drama and tragedy. I’d just love to see that done and done well. Someday.
I agree that this trilogy should stand alone. But they’ll never kill off the Batman franchise for good in movie form. And maybe they don’t have to. But they definitely need to detach anything in the future from these movies.
Sadly, I agree. The franchise itself will never die. But seeing this chapter close and a new chapter open a few more years down the road, that would be nice.
Yeah I just can’t get behind the idea of introducing Robin into it, even though I know he is such an important part of the Batman universe. There is just so much cause for alarm with it. But then again, Nolan might do it right. Who knows.
That was a very fun article to read. I like your writing style, AussieSlayerette.
Put me in the “I want a third Nolan Batman film” camp. I think that the setup at the end of The Dark Knight would be a fun thing to explore in a third movie. I would love to see a movie where Batman is the “villain”, and more than just the stuff they’ve already included in the movies where the police are “looking” for him. If done right, it could be a completely different take on a superhero movie, and it’s a direction that I think would be very interesting to explore.
Thanks Polygon. I agree that Batman being the villain would be cool. In the Q and A pannel at Fox Studios in Sydney when Joss Whedon was out here for Serenity he actually talked about the Batman movies, specifically Batman Returns. He was saying that that movie went the wrong way by the Catwoman and the Penguin taking the idea of corrupting Batman as meaning they should frame him.
I worry that if they did decide to cast Batman in the next one as the villain that it might get off the beaten track like Returns did, or at least as Joss seems to think it did. Although I really did like Returns myself despite this. Plus I think Nolan has done such an awesome job so far that he is not likely to make that mistake but still, its possible.
If you wanna check out Joss’s thoughts the discussion is up on youtube and the Australian version of the 2 disc Serenity DVD.
Part 1 – http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=MxEITdMPPVg
Part 2 – http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=Zc0vCQSFJDU&feature=related
The question goes over the interchange between these sections but of course the whole pannel is worth watching if you’re interested.
I would love to see a third Batman, but not for a long time. I also agree, it definitely has to be done by Nolan. As much as I`d like to see one, I do worry about it though . I fear that it would turn out like the Spider Man trilogy. The first one was great, the second one was completely awesome, and the third sunk. It seemed like the third tried too hard to out do the first two that it became a mess. At least that is my take on it.
Even with my worries I still have faith Nolan could do something amazing. The avenue Polygon mentioned above could be dark and intriguing.
I think it would be so tragic if the third one sucked. But I’m hoping that doesn’t happen.
part of me doesn’t want a third Batman, simply becuase the expectations would be so high. It would be the Godfather Part III of superhero films unless they absoloutetly hit it out of the park.
I have the same reservations, but I also want it to be made, if only for the slim chance that they do hit it out of the park. What if the third movie was even better than the first two? It would be very difficult to pull off, but I don’t think it is impossible.
Batman rocks
Am I the only person in the whole of the geek community that loathes Nolan’s films? Honestly, I’d be much happier watching the Schumacher interpretations any day! I can respect the fact that Nolan is trying to put a different spin on the franchise but I think he’s done far too much! In particular he has changed Gotham city into a more “real” location so that it now resembles Chicago or any other main American city. Plus the new batmobile is ghastly and even Christian Bale I find attrocious! Especially as Bruce Wayne where he plays a selfish, arrogant playboy. Not only this but he is outshone by his own butler and Lucious Fox via pure acting talent. I can honestly say that I prefer George Cloony as Batman/Bruce Wayne!
However, there are elements of the newest films that I like but all of these are outweighed by the simple changing of the bat-symbol, I love the classic black and yellow logo and I want it back!
On a loosley related note I thought that the only reason Heath Ledger received so much praise for the role was because he died shortly after, the character lacked the insanity that Jack Nicholsen brought to the role leaving him as just a thug wearing make-up.
All in all, I love the Batman franchise umbrella and everything under it but I just can’t get into the latest films, they’re far too long yet still disjointed and I believe most fans are drawn to the films purely for the action sequences. The rest is just filler, ironically, the action sequences are really the most unrealistic element of the Nolan films.